Grandparents Residences
Hello, on the 5th of November quarterly meeting, I asked for assistance on finding locations in Czech Republic and Slovakia as my grandparents immigrated in the early 1900s. I am planning a trip to Czech Republic and Slovakia in September 2023, and I would like to get started on where to find a local genealogist, as well as records associated with my family. Initially, I would like to know if anyone can help with pinpointing these locations.
Thank you! Linda Chambliss
My maternal grandmother Maria Toth, arrived on the SS Cedric 29 January 1921. Her last permanent address was: Cz-Slav (country), Abanjska (city). The name and complete address of the nearest relative in country whence alien came is: Mother Marie Toth, Kralowec, Abanjska, Cz-Slav. This info is taken from the manifest. In her petition for naturalization, she listed her birthplace as Kralovce, Czechoslovakia. She was naturalized in January 1942.
My paternal grandmother Frieda Kotalik, arrived, named Bedruska Kotalik arrived on the SS Main in October 1912. She arrived with her family and their last permanent address was Bohemia (country) and Pisek (city or town). Her maternal grandmother was left in Bohemia. Alabela Heirova, living in Pisek, Taborski nl Bohemia - from the passenger manifest. She was naturalized in 1961, and indicated that she was from Czechoslovakia.
My paternal grandfather Gustav Ipser, arrived on SS Washington in November 1913. He came from Bohemia (country), Lhota (town or city). Relative in that country was his father: Josef Ipser, could be Pislaova or Pis?aova, Lhota, Bohemia. His petition for naturalization indicates that he was born in Arkvice, Czechoslovakia and his last foreign address was Piskana, Czechoslovakia. In another document, his declaration of intention he indicates that he was born in Cirkvice, Bohemia.
Linda,
I hired Michael Razus a few years back.
He helped a lot. Searching for grandfather Huszar in Eastern Sk.He did a beautiful print out for me. Searching through Catholic Slovak Churches, I also found history of names and town. In my searches for families i did come across a Maria Toth. But which one. Many. Going through records, you will find lots of Anna, Eva, Maria, Theresia etc. Keep looking. Just one personal comment. Growing up, we had neighbors Toth, went to school together in Western PAI am a 2nd generation born in USA
Joanne
Hi, Linda, I have not forgotten you and I spent a bunch of time today researching your family. (Well, I also got my mother-in-law's tree decorated) and I really had a ton of difficulty on most of it. So here's the update:
1) Gustav Ipser: I searched Piskova Lhota and Cirkvice in a few different locations including Kostelni Lhota (Podborany), Krnsko (Mlada Boleslav) for Piskova Lhota; and Kutna Hora, Litomerice and Vavrinec (Kolin). In none of them was I able to find records newer than abt 1881. The records after that are not yet posted. You may need to contact a genealogist in the Kolin/Kutna Hora area (maybe Blanka Lednicka) to go to the archive and check the books that are not yet online.
2) Maria Toth: I have not done a lot on this name, but I am wondering if there is a chance she was not Czech but rather Slovak. The birthplace spelling of Kralovce on her naturalization record might point toward that Slovak town. Michal Razus might be a good contact to search those local records.
3) Bedruska Kotalik: Here I was successful, but your birthdate is incorrect (happens all the time). https://digi.ceskearchivy.cz/6383/179/3051/2855/40/0 Here is the link to the Pilsen archive page listing the birth of Bedriska Alzbeta Kotalikova on 6 Oct 1897. Her grandmother's married name is not Hierova, but Stejrova. The letter H can be confused with an St depending upon who did the handwriting, but it is pretty clear in this record. There are other children born to this family. https://digi.ceskearchivy.cz/6430/92/1160/1085/49/0 Here us the page where Bedriska is listed. There are other births with that surname in the earlier 1890's but with different house numbers--might be cousins. She has a brother born 5 Dec 1898, so her 1898 birthdate has to be incorrect. That index is a bit of a mess. Some of the K entries are back on image 5 and there are more that are somewhere else but the bottom of the page saying where is tattered. But I didn't see any more kids born in house #100 through 1904 so not sure what the story is there. More for you to explore!
That's it. I think it is time you quickly hire some assistance with the Ipser and Toth names. It's a bit of a wild goose chase finding the villages. You have some clues for Ipser for sure but with the records not yet posted in the most likely Cirkvice or Piskova Lhota you need to get someone to go to the arhives and look directly before you make the trip!
Good luck and keep me posted if you find more!!! Jerry
In reply to I found Bedruska! by jerrymartinek
Jerry - thank you so much. This is a great find and I'm so grateful to you for finding it and leading me to a new path.
I'll take your advice on Toth and Ipser and hiring someone for help.
Regards, Linda
Dear Jerry - thank you so much!
1) Maria Toth: What is her birthdate? 3 July 1906
Abanjska is an unusual name for a village in the Czech lands, and the Toth name is a bit unusual as well. I did a bit of exploring on MyHeritage and did find a couple references to the Toth surname in Slovakia and Hungary. The village Kralowec and variant spellings are fairly common in Bohemia and also can be found in Slovakia. So, first, can you tell me where you found the manifest?
Here is where you can find her passenger manifest: https://www.ancestry.com/imageviewer/collections/7488/images/NYT715_2917-0673?pId=4025016378
2) Bedruska Kotalik: What is her birthdate? 24 Sept 1898
3) Gustav Ipser: birthdate is 5 February 1888
I do not know anything about Alzbeta.
I am very excited and thank you so much for your help. I plan a trip in September 2023 and would really like to get in front of this.
Thanks Linda
Hi, Linda, It's always a challenge discovering the correct spelling of the village and even individual names. I've got a couple questions for you and a few additional thoughts.
1) Maria Toth: What is her birthdate? Abanjska is an unusual name for a village in the Czech lands, and the Toth name is a bit unusual as well. I did a bit of exploring on MyHeritage and did find a couple references to the Toth surname in Slovakia and Hungary. The village Kralowec and variant spellings are fairly common in Bohemia and also can be found in Slovakia. So, first, can you tell me where you found the manifest? I'd like to take a look at the handwriting and see if there is an alternate spelling to Abanjska that might be a better clue.
2) Bedruska Kotalik: What is her birthdate?
3) Gustav Ipser: https://www.public-juling.de/passagierlisten/listen.php?ArchivIdent=FSI…; I did find this Bremen passenger list for Gustav and Bohumil Ipser, ages 25 and 30 respectively, both from the village of Lhota Piskova in Bohemia. Ipser is also an unusual surname. I did an initial search in the Central Bohemia records for the village and did not find the surname in the birth index. What is Gustav's birthdate? His birth may have been missed in the birth index and might be found in the actual pages of the births. Mapy.cz shows 3 villages named Cirkvice. The one by Uhlirske Janovice is somewhat close to the village of Piskova Lhota/Lhota Piskova (the two variants could be used interchangeably over time). That might be an area to explore in the Central Bohemia archives. https://ebadatelna.soapraha.cz/pages/SearchMatrikaPage?1
And a couple comments in general: Alabela is an unusual given name. I'll suggest it might be Alzbeta a very common name meaning Elizabeth in English. The Heirova female name was not found in the Pisek proper indexes, but she may have been living in a smaller village whose records are listed in a different parish than Pisek, but still very close to the area. I did, however, find the surname Hejl (Hejlova for a female) The letter "j" and "i" were used interchangeably at different times. Again, it is possible that the record looks like Heir but might be Heil. Do you know her husband's name or anything else about her?
Those are some initial thoughts. If you can supply more information, I'll give it another run and see if we can find at least one of those people!
Welcome to CGSI!!!!!
Jerry